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crazysnakeman
Snake Mite
42 Posts |
 Posted - 26/06/2010 : 17:17:52
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Heya, my 4 year old corn fasted 7 weeks ago for 3 months, she has eaten fine the past 7 weeks, but is losing weight at about 10 grams a week.. She got a mm long cut on one scale that became infected, but i've treated it, and it's cleared up, but the "scab" i guess will be there untill she next sheds.
I don't think the tiny cut would cause weight loss, especially when shes still eating.. could it be internal parasites?? She gets 2 adult mice a week, the past two weeks she has had an adult mouse and a similar sized rat to see if it made a difference, and the graphs i keep show that she only lost 9 grams this week.. shes gone from 700 grams down to 647, I'm beggining to think of a trip to the vets..
Her stools seem normal, shes eating normal, excercising normal, the small cut isn't infected, but it only happened last week, so it wouldnt explain the previous 6 weeks.. I ordered digital scales as soon as she went off feed, volcano eruption etc halted it's delivery and it only arrived at the end of her fasting, so i have no idea if she was losing weight during her fast, and if this is the continuation of that..
Any suggestions?
Also, for a 4 and a half foot corn, what would you feed per week / 10 days / 2 weeks?
Cheers,
Josh |
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crazysnakeman
Snake Mite
42 Posts |
Posted - 26/06/2010 : 18:09:18
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Oh, the adult mice arent the large ones, The pet shop here calls them standard mice..
Cheers,
Josh |
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crazysnakeman
Snake Mite
42 Posts |
Posted - 26/06/2010 : 18:27:36
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and the other thing is i bought a bulk pack of 50 mice - a couple of royals i have are on the same size mouse, but i am really not impressed with the rodents, I get paid monthly, but couldnt afford more rodents last month when I already had budgeted for the 50 i bought.. the mice are a bit grotty, thin, wood shavings in the bag, not vaccuum packed etc.. could it be that these mice are just not as nutritional as my usual suppliers? they stopped doing frozen rodents except for in bulk, so i had to change.. the corn is much more hesitant about taking them then she ever has been on other rodents.. this idea just occured to me, I get paid next week and will definately change supplier, but do you guys think this could be a cause first and foremost?
im going to change supplier and bin the current mice i have - the rats are from the old supplier - and buy some from my vet (breeds his own and i know my corn loves them), but i still really want to know if parasites or a possible other cause could be doing this? is 7 to 10 grams a week something to worry about? how long should i leave it before taking her to the vet? he doesnt charge much so im not bothered about the finances for that! do you think i can leave it another few weeks to see if different mice have a positive affect?
Cheers,
Josh |
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crazysnakeman
Snake Mite
42 Posts |
Posted - 27/06/2010 : 13:43:38
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nobody?
Josh |
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reptiledanny
Sub Adult
United Kingdom
1809 Posts |
Posted - 27/06/2010 : 14:03:14
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| i cant help u with this as i have no idea but im sure someone who may now what is going on will help you soon, hope she gets better soon |
1.1 royal pythons 0.1 hog island boa 1.0 corn snake
sig made by stapey |
Edited by - reptiledanny on 27/06/2010 14:03:22 |
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Mouse
Yearling
United Kingdom
958 Posts |
Posted - 27/06/2010 : 15:22:36
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well, first thing to do is look at her. Is she obviously getting skinny? Everyone's corns will be different weights, and although there is a 'guide' I guess to weights, some are bigger and some are smaller.
if she still has good muscle tone then thats good.
whats your set up?
I doubt the infection would influence it that much.
If you're worried, then take one of the stools and ask the vet to send it to a lab for testing.
Mine is about 5 ft (my girl anyhew!) and she'll be on 1 large mouse every 5-6 days. My snow who is a little shorter is on one large every 7ish days, as that's when he seems to be hungry! |
 
1.0.0 - Gobo - Snow Corn (RIP)
0.1.0 - Sprockett - Normal/hypo/het snow Corn
2.0.0 Anery Hatchlings
0.1.0 Amel Hatchling
0.1.0 Normal Hatchling
*Location - Southampton, UK*
http://www.weneedcake.co.uk |
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crazysnakeman
Snake Mite
42 Posts |
Posted - 27/06/2010 : 16:43:05
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set up is 29 degrees on one side, 22 at the other, water bowl, 2 hides, 3 and a half foot viv, but at the moment is on newspaper, with 0% humidity, to stop the infection becoming reinfected.. It's been hard the past few weeks keeping the lower end temperature down, it's so warm outside! I guess an increase in outside temps might increase her metabollic rate.. ok, I may only just be feeding enough rodent to her then, but if they are bad quality then that would still explain it.. ok, well i gave her a rat and a mouse this week, we'll see if her weight stabalises, if it doesnt, to the vet she goes!
Cheers,
Josh |
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Kellog
the nice one
United Kingdom
7308 Posts |
Posted - 28/06/2010 : 06:25:47
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It certainly is worrying that she is losing weight but eating. You say her stools are normal so it would seem as though she is absorbing the nutrients as usual....
For her to have lost 53g but to be feeding on adult mice.... You say you have a graph of her weight....is the weight loss getting smaller, you mention that she 'only' lost 9 grams this week, does this mean she has lost more previously? Although you also say she is losing weight about 10g a week.... sorry, thinking aloud here  ....
You say she is exercising normally, is she behaving normally when handled and does she 'feel' normal or can you feel that she is out of condition?
When you feed her the 2 adult mice does it leave a bump? If not then she may need to go up to the jumbo mice, as long as they are not more than 1.5 times the width of her at her widest part. My 5yr old has been on jumbos for a while now, started off on them every 10 days and is now on them fortnightly as he has reached his maximum weight so just needs to be maintained.
It may be worthwhile feeding her on the rats as they are thought to be more nutritious, but they are high in fat (which wouldnt be too much of an issue at the moment in her case). But just to get her weight up a bit it might be worthwhile.
Please be aware that I am no expert and I do still wonder whether a trip to the vets might be worthwhile, certainly if she has lost weight again after this next feed.
Please let us know how she is doing.
xxx
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crazysnakeman
Snake Mite
42 Posts |
Posted - 28/06/2010 : 14:01:05
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Well, I just ordered some jumbo / XL mice from my vet, he said he'd have them euthanased on friday so that I can pick them up fresh. My corn loves them from him, they are just a bit more expensive! but, good quality food equals a good quality snake, so we shall see if they make a difference.. also, I have a royal that I can't get to take rats at all, anybody have any suggestions on moving a snake from mice to rats when they dont recognise rats as food?? feeding several mice instead of a larger rat can get expensive!
Cheers,
Josh |
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hiper2009
Banned
United Kingdom
2197 Posts |
Posted - 28/06/2010 : 14:57:56
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quote:
Originally posted by crazysnakeman
I have a royal that I can't get to take rats at all, anybody have any suggestions on moving a snake from mice to rats when they dont recognise rats as food?? feeding several mice instead of a larger rat can get expensive!
Cheers,
Josh
Hi Have you tried scenting your rat with the mouse or braining the rat?  |
0.0.0 Royal Python Het Pied 100% CB10 - Chaos
1.1.0 Brazilian Rainbow Boa CB10 - Bow/Mayhem
0.1.0 Cornsnake Amel Het Motley CB10 - Fire
1.0.0 Cornsnake Caramel Het Motley CB09 - Whisky
1.0.0 Cornsnake Snow Het Stripe CB07 - Romeo - R.I.P
1.0.0 Super Golden Labrador Dog CB02 - Bailey
Wish List:
1.2.0 Royal Python - Pastel , Pinstripe , Lesser. |
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mikerichards
don't say the 'M' word!
United Kingdom
2901 Posts |
Posted - 28/06/2010 : 15:30:38
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Royals are notoriously picky feeders, some dont ever go onto rats, but its worth keep trying.
As for the corn, its worth giving the vet a stool sample and getting it sent of to a vet lab, they can tell you if there is a problem within the snake, something like worms.
Food wise, if he/she is willing to take more, then give more, it maybe that the food you are giving just isnt enough to cover the energy being used.
The sample is the first step really, there is a lot of weight being lost, even 9g over a week is substantial for an animal that only weighs say 450g, thats a 2% weight loss a week, when eating normally, thats just not right.
For a 4.5 ft corn, usually a large/jumbo mouse ever 10 days or so. You can also try small rat weaners, mine take them no problems, and there is more goodness in those too, and more fat.
There is a lot of hype about feeding corns rats, most of it is unfounded, however, i feed my lot rats on a regular basis, and they do absolutely fine on them. I even feed my babies rat pups as soon as they are big enough. |
Location : Worthing, West Sussex
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hiper2009
Banned
United Kingdom
2197 Posts |
Posted - 28/06/2010 : 15:50:51
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quote:
Originally posted by mikerichards
I feed my lot rats on a regular basis, and they do absolutely fine on them. I even feed my babies rat pups as soon as they are big enough.
I agree with you on this Mike , I fed my hatchling ratpups and he was fine now hes taking small mice, I also feed Romeo weaner rats every 3weeks if i have some left over.  |
0.0.0 Royal Python Het Pied 100% CB10 - Chaos
1.1.0 Brazilian Rainbow Boa CB10 - Bow/Mayhem
0.1.0 Cornsnake Amel Het Motley CB10 - Fire
1.0.0 Cornsnake Caramel Het Motley CB09 - Whisky
1.0.0 Cornsnake Snow Het Stripe CB07 - Romeo - R.I.P
1.0.0 Super Golden Labrador Dog CB02 - Bailey
Wish List:
1.2.0 Royal Python - Pastel , Pinstripe , Lesser. |
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crazysnakeman
Snake Mite
42 Posts |
Posted - 28/06/2010 : 21:55:35
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hmmmm, im thinking more and more that it may be me not feeding enough, she has been far more active past two months, and it's been really warm, it might be a combination of the two.. ok, well I'll get the vet to sort some rats for me too then, see how it goes! the vet said the same as you guys, but he also said it's worth testing different food types first, and if theres no improvement hel do a stool check for me. he saw her 3 weeks ago for a check up (I get them all done anually in terms of feeling for lumps and bumps etc, but I never got him to check her stools before..) so, I'll give it 2 weeks at the max, shes a good weight, not skinny at all.. I think Even if she stops losing weight these next two weeks il get a stool check.. I have 3 snakes that haven't had one done, all 3 came from a guy I know is very good and experienced, they never had a problem till now, where as the rest of my collection came from elsewhere and they all got completely checked before they arrived here and quarantined.. I should take all 3 in really.. hmmmm.. ok, thanks guys!
As to the scenting, how do you go about it? if I was to make a method up, i'd wash the rat off in water, get a dry defrosted mouse and rub them together a bit, then try it.. but is there a better way? I havn't brained one yet.. I did trick him into eating one this week, offered a mouse first, when he fixed his sights on it and moved towards it i switched it for a rat on a second pair of tongs and he took it before the tongs were in the tank! however, If i can get him to just take it instead of this method, that would be good! hes my only royal.. 2 yrs old, but didnt eat for 10 of those months! so hes underweight for his age, but hes being a bit of a pig now.. ha ha, bless..
Cheers,
Josh |
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mikerichards
don't say the 'M' word!
United Kingdom
2901 Posts |
Posted - 28/06/2010 : 23:09:30
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To be honest, get the sample done asap, that way, if its something that needs to be caught early, you have the best chance, if its nothing then you know its down to feeding, you can never be armed with enough information.
As for feeding, and getting the rats from the vets, its worth finding out how he kills the mice and rats, if he gasses with co2 then its not a problem, but any kind of chemical is a big no no. Even if he just hits it over the head is fine, but is he gasses with anything other than co2 they shouldnt used, and also, why they are being killed too, whether its because they are ill, or if he breeds them himself.
As for the royal, once you can get him eating rats, he will be a good one, you could always try heating the rat up in boiling water, not for too long because they have a bad habit of gutting themselves when constricted, its not nice i promise!
Perseverance is the key. |
Location : Worthing, West Sussex
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crazysnakeman
Snake Mite
42 Posts |
Posted - 29/06/2010 : 01:41:10
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yeah, he gasses them with CO2.. he has a collection of over 200 snakes and breeds his own rodents for his personal use, but he does a few people favours like sexing snakes etc or consultations for free, I guess it brings business in better! but there you go!, I guess it makes more sense to do the stool sample asap, ok, cheers guys, I'll keep you updated!
Josh |
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crazysnakeman
Snake Mite
42 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2010 : 21:24:14
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Stool sample started today, I couldn't stay for the whole thing, was gonna take 3 hours and I had work! but The microscope showed no eggs, larvae or body parts, or any evidence of internal parasites.. vets gonna phone me tomorro with the results of a floatation test, and staining for crypto.. but he said the stool was normal and that he doubted he would find anything! but, we shall see! thought id let you know, il keep you updated tomorro!
Josh |
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mikerichards
don't say the 'M' word!
United Kingdom
2901 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2010 : 22:40:35
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| Thats cool then, if he does his own then its fine. I would guess then, try feeding him more! i spoke to Kate about it and the only other thing she suggested are blood parasites, but to be fair, its unlikely. I think keep a close eye on him, feed him more than hes usually on, and see how the weight goes. If weight carrys on going down, then some more in depth analysis is going to be needed. |
Location : Worthing, West Sussex
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Kellog
the nice one
United Kingdom
7308 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2010 : 03:53:52
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Am really glad that you went ahead and got a stool sample examined Josh, I didnt really like the idea of you waiting in case there was an underlying issue....but it sounds as though there isnt which is great news .
Lets just hope that you increasing the amount you feed her helps her to start putting on weight....just please keep us updated - we worry cos we care  .
xxx
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Mouse
Yearling
United Kingdom
958 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2010 : 08:52:20
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| Hope the test results came back ok. Hope your snake is ok. |
1.0.0 - Gobo - Snow Corn (RIP)
0.1.0 - Sprockett - Normal/hypo/het snow Corn
2.0.0 Anery Hatchlings
0.1.0 Amel Hatchling
0.1.0 Normal Hatchling
*Location - Southampton, UK*
http://www.weneedcake.co.uk |
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crazysnakeman
Snake Mite
42 Posts |
Posted - 02/07/2010 : 16:29:04
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So the tests found 2 eggs, both fairly large and from a round worm. the vet said it isnt a large infestation, but the animal producing the eggs may be fairly large. However, he gave me a mouse injected with the medicine to feed her, so that should all be sorted! Cheers for the advise everyone, I'm glad I did a stool sample!
Josh |
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Sta~ple
qeeun speler
United Kingdom
6129 Posts |
Posted - 02/07/2010 : 16:43:20
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LMAO never heard of that just it's fairly amusing... although I guess that way they can't eat around a tablet like a dog does if you put it in it's food XD
How much did it cost to get a stool sample and do you know where it got sent off to? |
  
A very special super, duper thanks for K :3 |
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Snake losing weight..
