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mikeyd_26
Yearling
United Kingdom
716 Posts |
 Posted - 20/10/2011 : 23:12:09
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| my opinion was and still is on this topic, if a snake NEEDS live feeding, then do it! by becoming a snake owner you are responsible for that snake and that should be a priority. As said before people who live feed for laughs dont deserve the pleasure of snake ownership. But there is a time and a place for live feeding and i totally agree with mike r And lotabob they make sense as people who obviously care for there snakes. :) |
   
0.1.0 amel - TaLuLa
0.1.0 anery motley het amel, hypo - Bo
1.0.0 vanishing stripe unknown - Marley
1.0.0 hogg island boa - Iggy
0.1.0 hogg island boa - Luna
0.1.0 royal python - Buttons!
1.0.0 royal python 66% het albino - Steve
0.1.0 leopard gecko - Sheila
millions of beardies! |
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mikerichards
don't say the 'M' word!
United Kingdom
2901 Posts |
Posted - 25/10/2011 : 01:20:24
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quote:
Originally posted by tordyjo
this is not in reply to any particular comments just my feelings and views on the subject
As i said in the other post i think that particular video was 'an example' of how good a hunter and killers corn snakes can be. Is it any different to letting your pet cat out to go and hunt, catch, then play with what they have caught often not killing the animal letting it suffer throughout the process. Yes i am a cat owner and many times have i woken up to mouse or mouse guts at the bottom of the stairs - a mouse that was once alive and i've no doubt suffered a great deal more than one would have if fed to a snake. Its nature and the food chain, as a meat eater i am aware that meat i eat will have come from an animal that has been killed quickly and humanely - as humans we are able to do that, the snake is killing the mouse as quickly and humanely as is possible for the species.
Hope i've explained myself...............
EDIT - i do feed f/t however wouldn't hesitate in using a live mouse if the need ever arose (which is unlikely but can't be discounted)
Its a fair arguement, and a good one. Its also no different to feeding a leopard gecko live locusts, crickets and mealworms, i bet there are very few people who bat an eyelid at a cricket or locust being crushed or eaten live by a gecko.
I have cats aswell, and have rescued a fair few completely traumatised mice from the cats, completely unharmed but frozen with fear, they do the same with frogs, birds, and pretty much anything else that moves, in the youngest ones case, flies!!!
How many times have you seen a Kestrel or similar hovering at the side of the road, and not even thought of the mouse or vole its watching? Been fishing and not really thought about the fish you catch? Seen an eagle catch a fish and fly off with it and not thought about the fish? The point is, live feeding happens everywhere in nature, its natures way, watch an african plains program, you'll see it in a different light.
We feed out snakes defrost mostly because its cheaper, its the way it has been for many many years, so thats the way it is.
I still dont really get why people think a snake is going to be savaged by a live mouse, an adult mouse barely breaks my skin, let alone a snake that has scales, that is exactly why they have scales, to protect them from bites and scratches, rats are a whole different ball game to mice though, been bitten by one, sodding hurts, straight to the bone!!!
I can also assure you, your snake knows the difference between defrost and fresh kill, the smell is completely different, and they react accordingly, its natures inbuilt natural instincts. |
Location : Worthing, West Sussex
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SheWolfey
Hatchling
United Kingdom
148 Posts |
Posted - 25/10/2011 : 11:59:29
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I guess its peoples personal choice. If people want to live feed and their not making a show out of it then its fine. As long as its in the best interests of the snake though.
But if they are doing it for fun, then they shouldn't.
I probably couldn't live feed my self, but I can understand why people do (as long as they are not hurting the snake).  |
1.1.0 Cats (Baccus and Isis)
0.1.0 Carolina Corn (Indra) |
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smokeysfc
Egg
United Kingdom
75 Posts |
Posted - 17/06/2012 : 22:09:16
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| i couldnt feed a live mouse for fun but for survival of the snake at a last resort i would but i couldnt watch it those people that do it for fun need to think how would they feel being fed to a animal when they are alive i no that sounds really dramatic but feeding live animals to a snake for fun is really messed up people that get a kick out of it are messed up and id advise to go see a mental health specialist like i said people that live feed for survival of the snake then fair enough i see that as necesary like if you was standed with no water but a dirty puddle would you drink it to survive |
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QueenVic
Yearling
United Kingdom
849 Posts |
Posted - 18/06/2012 : 00:36:47
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Yeah I wouldnt feed live unless the snakes life was in danger.
Its unnecessarily cruel to the mouse and puts the snake in potential danger..
If it will eat dead ones, then there's no need for live. imo :)
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0.1.0 Normal (Espher)
1.0.0 Snow (Midnight)
2 GALS
1 rat (Jasper)
1 very needy staffy (Coco)
Location: Ossett
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liamewan
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
13 Posts |
Posted - 16/10/2012 : 21:28:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Kehhlyr
This is always a nice hot topic, and I thought it'd be interesting to start it again seeing as we have some new 'faces' that might find the discussions interesting.
Please remember that it's not an opportunity to vent directly at people, but likewise sensible opinions/thoughts are welcomed.
quote:
Originally posted by matty18714
Live feeding is a grey area in the law. It is perfectly legal to live feed in the UK aslong as you arnt doing it to cause deliberate suffering or for entertainment. I have also heared that you should show that you have tried all other appropriate measures to feed the snake, but I think thats rubbish myself, though I havent checked.
I've been told that live feeding for entertainment or because you want 'to see what it's like' IS illegal as it's then classed as being cruel to the animal (both snake and the mice).
Live feeding for the survival of a snake is NOT illegal.
The reason it's a grey area is exactly as Matty said, it's very hard to prove you've exhausted all other options first.
I've said it before hand (and shall say it again) that in some ways look at it like dog fighting;
Dogs that have a scrap in the field while on walkies is just 2 dogs fighting, nothing wrong with that.
Dogs that are organised to fight purely so that people can watch is illegal.
See what I mean there.
Discuss.
/quick edit
Remember that the laws for live feeding as stated above are only the UK laws.
Other countries (north america etc) have always seemed to live feed, so therefore it's not frowned upon as it is over here, so please remember that as well.
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please red this thread http://www.thecornsnake.co.uk/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=15428 |
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liamewan
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
13 Posts |
Posted - 16/10/2012 : 21:31:44
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How long should I defrost my pinkie as this is the first time I am feeding Kellogg and so far the pinkie was defrosted overnight in the fridge the left an hour before feeding at room temp and it has been in with him for half hour and so far he hasn't touched it so naturally I am worried!!!!!
HELP |
signature turned off by gmac due to size
please red this thread http://www.thecornsnake.co.uk/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=15428 |
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ScalySituation
Fully Grown Corn
United Kingdom
5292 Posts |
Posted - 16/10/2012 : 21:54:58
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First off don't worry
Try warming it up, some use warm water, some use a hair dryer
missing one meal for them is like us missing breakfast, you have so many Weeks and so many tactics to try before you need to worry
Have a look at the sticky in the health section on non feeders |
1.0.0 Butter motley corn (Sheldon)
0.1.0 Caramel Corn (Maggie)
0.1.0 Caramel motley corn (Echo)
1.0.0 Cat (Angus)
1 mealworm colony
RIP Skye x
Sleep well Sonny, Mummy loves you xx
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AcidicAngel
Sub Adult
United Kingdom
1212 Posts |
Posted - 27/02/2013 : 21:54:15
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I would like to voice my opinion on this
I will say straight out that my snakes have had F/T and Fresh Killed. Well, Sakana has had Live too. The live was actually a genuine accident though and will never be done again. You may now be asking "How was it an accident? Surely you knew you were putting a live mouse into the viv?" and my answer is that A. It wasn't in the viv and B. I didn't even know the mouse was there. I had got her out for a hold before her due feed, took her through to my uncles living room. She was still my uncles snake and my uncle was away at work so I was looking after her. I cleared space on the floor, hoovered with her round my neck and put her on the floor for a roam. Obviously I kept my eye on her and because I was so focused on her I didn't notice the live mouse that had decided the back door being open looked interesting... You can guess what happened next. Sakana's instincts took over, she struck, coiled and ate the mouse within about 5 minutes. I've never seen her move so fast! I didn't know there was anything there till she started eating and then I realized why she'd struck. I quickly put the frozen mouse back in the freezer while she was eating and when she finished I took her back to her viv. Early, unintended and could have ended badly due to my... Well I was being a good owner by keeping a very close eye on her while she wandered round on the floor but a bad owner by not keeping my eye open for any wildlife that came to investigate. So there's Sakana's story. Luckily the mouse was healthy, or at least appeared to be since Sakana never came to any harm and was never ill after. I was lucky with that.
Now, onto the reason for Fresh Killed. Both snakes were off their food, not even taking chick-scented mice so I called my friend who breeds mice and asked her to bring 2 over for me. They were near adult or "hoppers" and about 19 grams in weight. I did the usual way of killing them, smack their heads against a hard desk as hard as possible without actually splitting their heads and it worked. Both mice were dead before being offered to the snakes.
And obviously as everyone knows, my snakes will readily take F/T mice.
My opinion on this could be sort of seen as hypocritical with Sakana's incident but I would say that if all other options have been tried and the snake will definitely not eat anything and if losing weight quickly then you can live feed. For entertainment or because you like it is not acceptable. Obviously, I know Sakana is capable of getting the correct hold on the mouse before coiling so that it doesn't bite her if I ever had to live feed but I would still keep an eye on her. I would be a lot more anxious to live feed Cereus as he grabs mice by the stomach and doesn't coil very tightly... Hence the mouse would be capable of biting and probably would take ages to die.
This is only my opinion and I don't expect everyone to agree. I'm also sort of expecting some replies like "Why would you let the snake roam?" or something. That was because my uncles exceptionally large living room was perfect for Sakana and her sibling(Red) to have some stretch out time. I'd got Sakana out first and when she went back was going to get Red out... That plan went away when Sakana did her trick. I left Red's mouse out and let that defrost, when it was finished defrosting I removed Red from the viv and fed Red in his feeding tub |
Corn Snakes.
1.0 Butter - Cereus.
1.0 Caramel Stripe het Amel - Vladimir.
0.1 Normal het Amel, Caramel, Hypo - Amara.
0.1 Masque het Amel, Anery, Charcoal, Diffused, Hypo, Lavender, Stripe - Aurelia.
1.0 Masque Anery het Amel, Charcoal, Diffused, Hypo, lavender, Stripe - Orion.
Leopard Gecko's.
Too many to list!!
Rat Snake.
1.0 Yellow Rat Snake - Leviathan(Levi)
Western Hognoses
1.0 Normal 50% poss het Frosted(Dutch Hypo, Caramel) - Thorne.
0.1 Frosted - Rose.
1.0 Anaconda het Snow(Amel, Anery) - Titan.
0.1 Normal het Snow(Amel, Anery) - Nyx.
R.I.P Pandora & Sakana, entwined in my heart forever my darlings. |
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