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118 Posts |
 Posted - 16/08/2008 : 21:31:02
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ok, so i sit here most nights reading through all of your posts, sum thinking wow what a good idea n some thinking oh my god why lol
so, i was thinking, rather than sarching all the websites and pet shop advice maybe everyone on here should just learn off each other?
i know i maybe stirring up a hornets nest here, but heating a corn at 30degrees really isnt needed?
i have been involved in corn, king,rat snake breeding n caring for the last 4 yrs, so i go by what ive learnt myself and not what pet shops tell me, i have just suplied 3 friends with hatchlings, all pet shops recommended a 3ft viv with 3ft heatmat, are they serious?
i have raised 2 corns to 3 n half yr old with no heat mats at all, have always eaten, shed and been fantastic snakes!
i did eventually get a heatmat but one of them has never been anywhere near it.
i know many of you would find this hard to believe but as my best friend has over 170 corns now, i like to think she knows what shes doing and taught me everything i know.
when they are in the wild they live by mother nature and that means temp changes etc, they dont have anyone turning it up n down n testing it on a daily basis so why do we do this?
i have had 6 royals all of a very large size and had all the temp set ups etc cos it was needed but im finding corns are fine without it n starting to think most of it is money making ideas?
anyway, thats my rant, i would like to assure anyone worrying bout temps that your corns would be perfectly fine without constant monitoring etc.
also, corns live in very large packs in the wild so why are we worried bout keeping 2 3 or even 4 together and prem breeding?
if a female is well fed and healthy there is no reason why they dont breed in the wild once mature enough to produce eggs?
i currently have 2 hatchlings living very happy and healthy in a none heated viv close to a normal household source of heat, feeding and shedding and growing well.
im hoping you will all post with hints and tips and what you have found has worked for you, and maybe put it down to what we all like as individuals and not rant at each other n make us think we are doing it wrong.
everyone has their way and should be respected for it and maybe we could all learn off each other? |
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Blackecho
The Corn Snake Admin
United Kingdom
4379 Posts |
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300 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 21:43:53
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| iv never heard of corns living in packs but il take your word for it and see wat every one els says |
cb07 - male - corn snake
cb07 - male - red tailed boa
cb06 - female - salmon pink tarantula
wc - male-female - asian forest scorpions
indian stick insects
2 african land snails
soon to be mine-
4 red bellied toads or a emperor scorpion cant decide :P |
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Blackecho
The Corn Snake Admin
United Kingdom
4379 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 21:44:56
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quote:
Originally posted by speedwaybabe
i have raised 2 corns to 3 n half yr old with no heat mats at all, have always eaten, shed and been fantastic snakes!
when they are in the wild they live by mother nature and that means temp changes etc, they dont have anyone turning it up n down n testing it on a daily basis so why do we do this?
Reptiles are cold blooded, that means that they can't regulate their own temperature. In the wild if they need to warm up they find somewhere warm, if they need to cool down they find somewhere cooler. How would they do this in a viv that doesn't have a temperature gradient? |
 
www.theroyalpython.co.uk/forum
Location: Rotherham
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Blackecho
The Corn Snake Admin
United Kingdom
4379 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 21:47:42
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quote:
Originally posted by speedwaybabe
i know many of you would find this hard to believe but as my best friend has over 170 corns now, i like to think she knows what shes doing and taught me everything i know.
I could keep 170 puppies in a small box and they'd probably all live, doesn't mean their life is good.
You can keep calves in crates with no light to make Veal, doesn't mean they have a good quality of life. |
www.theroyalpython.co.uk/forum
Location: Rotherham
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300 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 21:58:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Blackecho
quote:
Originally posted by speedwaybabe
i know many of you would find this hard to believe but as my best friend has over 170 corns now, i like to think she knows what shes doing and taught me everything i know.
I could keep 170 puppies in a small box and they'd probably all live, doesn't mean their life is good.
You can keep calves in crates with no light to make Veal, doesn't mean they have a good quality of life.
ye i once new someone who had thouses of chickns all cooped up in a small room with no space to walk |
cb07 - male - corn snake
cb07 - male - red tailed boa
cb06 - female - salmon pink tarantula
wc - male-female - asian forest scorpions
indian stick insects
2 african land snails
soon to be mine-
4 red bellied toads or a emperor scorpion cant decide :P |
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matty18714
The Count of Corniness
United Kingdom
4428 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 23:15:54
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I undestand your point about not having a heat source. In the wild they will find a hot place if they are too cold and a cold place if they are too hot. This is unquestionable. The snake cant tell you its too cold or too hot but it will still live. Corns, being easy feeders, are unlikly to regurge their dinner, but that doesnt mean they are finding it easy to digest it without a heat source. Because they cant talk to us, we try to copy the way they live in the wild.
Edit = I also think we people are doing just fine learning from each other. Thats the main point of the forum. |
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Edited by - matty18714 on 16/08/2008 23:23:55 |
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Blackecho
The Corn Snake Admin
United Kingdom
4379 Posts |
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193 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 23:33:43
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| yer but a 60 wat bulb is a heat sours, so do you need a heat mat? the bulb will heat the viv and the floor of the viv just the same as the sun would. |
[URL=http://www.mybannermaker.com] [/URL]
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matty18714
The Count of Corniness
United Kingdom
4428 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 23:38:57
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The way i see it is:
A gradient of 28*-30* as a peak heat on the hot side
and a temp of around 20*-23*-ish on the cool side.
Naturaly, both of these will fall in the night which is fine. As long as the temps are met everything will be fine (bulbs/mats). |
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Blackecho
The Corn Snake Admin
United Kingdom
4379 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 23:42:02
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quote:
Originally posted by jakethesnake
yer but a 60 wat bulb is a heat sours, so do you need a heat mat? the bulb will heat the viv and the floor of the viv just the same as the sun would.
Nothing wrong with a bulb in my opinion, certainly better than nothing
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www.theroyalpython.co.uk/forum
Location: Rotherham
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saddleninja
Sub Adult
United Kingdom
1400 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 23:48:52
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wow i that will stir up a hornets nest
ok heat source
in the wild corn don`t have a heat mat so they will find a source of heat to thermoregulate, so they will move into sunlight and when they are warm enough they will move into shade.
my corns live in vivs and as much as i love em i don`t let them have a front door key to come and go as they please, so if my reptile room is freezing cold but my kitchen is nice and warm they can`t move there and curl around my kettle by choice.
dogs, wolves and playing cards live in packs
some snakes in the wild will come together in a group like western diamond back when they brumanate for the winter but they come and go when they choose and the time is right, not like keeping 15 corns in a 4 foot viv all the time, where they can`t go their own way and would have to live in each others waste would be detremental to their health,
breeding?
my daughter started her periods when she was 10, and now she is 13 i know she is able but i hope not to have any grandchildren for a few more years
so to answer your rant we create an ideal enviroment for our corns in what ever viv we own, and the recomended things we do are for the best interest of our snakes |
1 amel
1 okeette
2 normals
1 rosy rat x
3 royals
1 cali king
1 publean milk
1 yemen chameleon
2 orange spotted agamas
1 colombian rainbow boa |
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193 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 23:49:35
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| thats ok i was unsure whether or not they need the heat from below to help them digest. the viv temp with a bulb could be 30 on the side with the bulb,but that may not be the temp of the ground,would that be a problem? |
[URL=http://www.mybannermaker.com][/URL]
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Blackecho
The Corn Snake Admin
United Kingdom
4379 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 23:51:59
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| Put the thermometer on the substrate and see what it reads, then adjust accordingly. |
www.theroyalpython.co.uk/forum
Location: Rotherham
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matty18714
The Count of Corniness
United Kingdom
4428 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 23:52:57
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| Jake, the temp should be ok. Do you have a thermometer? If so, make sure the temp doesn't exceed 30* on the ground level. |
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Blackecho
The Corn Snake Admin
United Kingdom
4379 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 23:55:15
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| Good reply Ninja. I think the gist of all our replies are that whilst some things are possible, these animals are pets so we try to do what's best for them, rather than trying to save money as it seems with the OP. |
www.theroyalpython.co.uk/forum
Location: Rotherham
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193 Posts |
Posted - 16/08/2008 : 23:58:22
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| yer i know that but did not know if i could use a bulb instead of a heat mat |
[URL=http://www.mybannermaker.com][/URL]
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saddleninja
Sub Adult
United Kingdom
1400 Posts |
Posted - 17/08/2008 : 00:02:00
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| totally agree with you BE |
1 amel
1 okeette
2 normals
1 rosy rat x
3 royals
1 cali king
1 publean milk
1 yemen chameleon
2 orange spotted agamas
1 colombian rainbow boa |
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118 Posts |
Posted - 17/08/2008 : 09:25:22
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thanx for the replies, seems we have different opinions already, im not saying we should keep corns (or puppies) in cardboard boxes under the sink and obviously my friend doesnt keep 170 corns in a 4ft viv, its common sense.
corns can live happily together is what im saying so no need to worry bout keeping them together, and as for comparing a teenager to a corn, thats just silly, my dog was 3 when we bred her but dont mean im gonna marry off my daughter at 13 does it...
and if you read my post you would see that my vivs are kept close to a normal household heat source, ie one backs onto a radiator wall, their temp is approx 24 and in my opinion this is fine and they have a huge water bowl if they were hot but as yet have not seen them in it?
all im saying is, i think we need to teach ourselves what we need to know, i have been told many a time not to use bulbs but it seems to work for sum people! |
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Lewy
The Corn Snake Admin
United Kingdom
2874 Posts |
Posted - 17/08/2008 : 09:32:45
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Life without a heat source for a corn, and keeping many together in one viv will only shorten the life of your corns. don't get me wrong... they'll live, but how do you know they are happy, the conditions are not ideal. The idea of adding a heat source is so you can replicate their natural environment.
I think I've said this in a post before that corns need to thermo-regulate and NEED a heat source.
There have been mentions of banning reptile keeping in the news and by certain groups - I can understand this in some cases.
Great advice has been given, but has been ignored and thought to be money making schemes.
My advice to you (for the best for your snake.... not your pocket) is to get a heat source in your viv, this will increase the life span and happiness of your corn snake. |
Lewy
THE CORN SNAKE.co.uk Team
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193 Posts |
Posted - 17/08/2008 : 12:23:10
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| o i have a heat mat heat lamp and a nightglo tube in my viv and temps are controld by stats i was just picking your brains as years ago i kept garter snakes and they did fine with just a bulb. intresting thred this and good to c different opinions all good advice is welcome |
[URL=http://www.mybannermaker.com][/URL]
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