| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| IdenticalTentacle |
Posted - 09/02/2010 : 17:36:18
Hello, I just bought my first little corn snake, and after reading this forum for a while, I have ordered a thermostat, thermometer, found a 2nd hide and done all the other stuff that the pet shop owners didn't tell me... But I think the vivarium is too cold with the heat mat they provided (it's only 7 watts, and even before my digital thermometer has arrived, I know it's not 30 degrees in there; I've put his viv next to a radiator in the mean time, but that isn't very practical).
My question is, what wattage heat mat should I go for? It's only a smallish plastic vivarium, so I don't want to nuke it with the biggest one I can find (although since I've ordered a thermostat, being too powerful won't really be a problem), and the higher wattage ones seem to be unecessarily large. I was thinking maybe a 14 or 20?
He's already regurgitated his first meal :( but I think he'll be fine now that I know to let him settle in for a week or two and once I've got his temperatures properly sorted.
Thanks! |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Kellog |
Posted - 13/02/2010 : 02:31:04
quote:
Originally posted by IdenticalTentacle
Thank you all very much for your kind words.
I will be going back to the shop on Monday to try to get a refund, but the cynical part of me suspects I won't have much luck.
I am afraid that I tend to agree with you Jack, I know others have tried to do this following problems (one where the snake died as well) but the shops rarely take responsibility and even more rarely do they give you a refund - but it is something that is necessary to do, if only to make a point to the shop.
However, I'm not going to give up on snake-keeping. I will follow bengy's advice and will also be sticking around this forum in the meantime.
I am so glad to hear that you will not be giving up on snake-keeping (I somehow doubted you would be able to walk away  ) and I am also glad you will be sticking around. Please keep asking questions and commenting, it is nice to know you are still with us!!
I'll let you all know what my next step is, but I will hopefully have an empty vivarium up and running within a week, ready for Freidrich II to move into when I find him.
Do keep us informed of how you are doing, and I am sure that once you walk into a shop and see 'the right one' then that empty viv wont be empty for very long!
xxx |
| IdenticalTentacle |
Posted - 12/02/2010 : 23:41:17
Thank you all very much for your kind words.
I will be going back to the shop on Monday to try to get a refund, but the cynical part of me suspects I won't have much luck. However, I'm not going to give up on snake-keeping. I will follow bengy's advice and will also be sticking around this forum in the meantime.
I'll let you all know what my next step is, but I will hopefully have an empty vivarium up and running within a week, ready for Freidrich II to move into when I find him. |
| Fal |
Posted - 12/02/2010 : 20:18:35
That was such a nice post Benjy, and I too hope you consider another snake in the future and hope you keep frequenting the forum until and as well as then! |
| SexyBear77 |
Posted - 12/02/2010 : 09:46:50
Fantastic advice from Bengy there Tentacle, everything he has said is perfect.
Please keep us posted about what you choose to do next, and hope to see you with a new snake in the future. |
| Kellog |
Posted - 12/02/2010 : 03:11:27
Jack, I am so sorry to hear about Friedrich...and shocked as well  . I know how hard you have been trying to learn as much as you can to be the best snake owner possible and that shows the commitment you had to Friedrich. I cannot even begin to imagine what it must have been like to come down and discover him like that  .
I echo everything already said, especially by Bengy....most of which I would have said myself (except the bit about the temps and stats, cos I dont know enough about them).
It definitely sounds as though you did everything you could for Friedrich and it is most likely something was already wrong with him, as already suggested, so nothing you did or didnt do would have changed the outcome.
I would certainly recommend that when you do get your next corn, and I am sure you will once you feel ready, that you aim for an older one....one that has a more proven history. I must admit that I started with an adult and it was so much more reassuring knowing that it was healthy and had been for 4 years and was a good feeder and shedder...all of which you cant tell with a hatchling. I know it means you miss out on their 'baby' period, but I feel it is worth it to be sure you are getting a healthy snake.
Take your time Jack, grieve for Friedrich and then, when you are ready, you can get a different corn...who wont ever be a replacement, but will be very lucky to have you as its owner.
You know that we are always here for you. Stay strong.
xxx |
| n/a |
Posted - 12/02/2010 : 00:46:04
Hi. I've just read this thread ready to try and help and find that poor Friedrich didn't make it. I am truely sorry.
I have a couple of suggestions to make and I hope it helps:
1. Take EVERYTHING back to the shop for a refund. Although it may or may not be his fault I would go elsewhere next time.
2. As you and others have said, read up on corns a little more (you seemed ready before but I know from experience how bad it makes you feel and research will help you get back on your feet).
3. When you do feel ready, purchase all the equipment you need BEFORE you get the snake. Maybe find the one you want and put a deposit down on him, and find AS MUCH out about him as possible (feeding records, shedding records, age and so on) Then go home with everything you need either from the new shop or ebay and as you'll now know your little guy's size (you may wish a slightly bigger one- perhaps a yearling) and so you can buy equipment accordingly. I suggest a yearling or a say 3+ month old corn as their mortality rate is a lot lower. Its hard to know if the snake will eat well or even live if the snake is only a few weeks old. Having said that there are shops out there only caring for cash not their LIVEstock. Others can be brilliant and only sell stock which is eating and seeming perfectly healthy, but will still have the odd few fatalities.
4. Once you've had the setup going and the temperatures running as needed for a few days, then go and pick the new guy up and bring him home.======== Just to add the info I was going to about the temperatures: The 4*C varience you had from 26-30 is perfectly acceptable. The stat is as it says an on off. Your snake will be perfectly happy with that varience at those temperatures. A pulse proportional (PP) stat is more accurate on temp but also heavier on your wallet. A dimmer stat will not work or not work accurately on a heat mat or any source with a wattage of less than 40w. By all means but a pp stat if you wish, but an on off stat is VERY widely used, more so than pp's I'd say.========
5. Leave him for a week as you know. Change his water and do everything you were doing correctly for that week. (Although it in no way caused the fate of your little fella, because you'll have the temps sorted, hopefully you can see how it is adventageous to have the viv set up and running before you get the snake home- so she or he will have more privacy in the "home settling week").
6. Feed the now hungry and calmer snake and leave for 48 hours.
7. Give him a hold and take a couple of photos and upload them onto the site!
Hopefully you find some of this helpful and please do not give up on snakekeeping. It is very common in hatchlings and you were not aware of any prior problems as the snake should have been sold in a healthy condition but as I said, it can be unpredictable even for an experienced keeper/breeder at that age.
If you (hopefully soon) do get another one, remember we are all here to lend advice and offer our experience at any point along the way! |
| Fal |
Posted - 11/02/2010 : 22:13:07
Really really sorry to here that mate! It's such a shame, but it's clear that you have been doing so much since finding this forum to make things right, so don't worry too much about the future and another corn. Maybe just give yourself some time and I am sure you'll feel ready again eventually - maybe start with an older corn in the future to put your mind at ease?
RIP Friedrich and take care Tentacle! |
| kdlang |
Posted - 11/02/2010 : 21:26:40
So very sorry to hear about friedrich. I echo above and from your posts it is clear how much you cared about your snake and were trying to get things right. Try not to fret too much that it was something you did, I think that is unlikely. Some things just aren't meant to be and it seems friedrich was poorly from the start. I hope we will still see you around these forums and when you decide the time is right to get another corn you will be well prepared and confident that you are doing your best again.
RIP Friedrich |
| elament |
Posted - 11/02/2010 : 18:47:28
Yep as SB and mike have said I doubt very much it was anything you did. So very sad to hear about your loss as Mike said very rightly some baby corns just dont make it and the fact he regurged his first meal may indicate there was some kind of internal issue. Try not to let it get you down too much. |
| SexyBear77 |
Posted - 11/02/2010 : 18:21:44
Completely agree with Mike, these things happen and it sucks but I doubt its your fault.
Very sorry to hear about Freidrich x |
| mikerichards |
Posted - 11/02/2010 : 18:14:31
Thats very sad, and i am sorry this has happened. From the sounds of it, its nothing you have done, a temp fluctuation wont kill the snake.
Sometimes baby corns just dont survive, there are many more factors than just temps.
Dont get yourself worked up about it, its not your fault.
What i would say though, before you get another one, have a read through some of the articles on here, get everything straight in your head, that way, when you buy another, you will be starting on a better foot.
How long have you had him? |
| IdenticalTentacle |
Posted - 11/02/2010 : 18:10:13
hey
ok
so im pretty upset now.. friedrich is dead . i noticed a funny smell coming from his viv and noticed that he hadnt moved inside his hide at all for about 24 hours. i lifted the hide a little and he didnt even twitch.. so i lifted it all the way off, still no movement.. so i poked the substrate next to him, and finally stroked him and nothing. im so sad...
he seemed fine yesterday, and even though the thermostat was fluctutating between 25.5 and 30.5, there wasn't anything i could have done that i wasnt trying.
i had the stat probe stuck to the heatmat outside the viv, it was still fluctuating that wildly, i had it attached to the thermometer probe with a rubber band inside the viv, it was still fluctutating wildly, i tried putting it here, there and everywhere, but after leaving it in each position for over an hour, the stat was still staying on to about 30 and off til about 26... and no, the viv wasnt in the sun, wasnt in a draught, wasnt next to a radiator and wasnt in a particularly cold or hot room.
iv been replacing his water daily, and other than that iv been hardly going near him other than to feed the stat probe into the tank.
did i do something wrong? iv been coming on here more than iv been doing my homework and anxiously checking everything about corn snake care matches what im doing..
im going to take everything back to the shop and ask for my money back, and perhaps in a week or two i will go check out another reptile house.. but nothing will bring little friedrich back, and now im worried that the same thing will happen again if i buy another corn.. |
| elament |
Posted - 11/02/2010 : 10:55:18
I would just add to that if your mat is in the viv to NOT use tape to secure the probe to the mat. Tape+snakes=Very bad idea indeed.
Editted to add...Mike i think what the OP is saying is that the stat seems to be taking too long to switch on and off. They should operate within a tolerance of around +-1degree c. So ideally if you set them for 28 when the temp drops to 27 or below the stat should come on which is NOT happening for him as it didnt for me. Try connecting the two probes together with a rubber band and place them inside the faun on the bottom of the faun over where the heatmat is (I am assuming you have the mat outside the faun)
To be honest I have vivs so I am not sure what is the best way to do this but some of the other members have and will advise accordingly. I am just saying I have found personally that the best way for me was connecting the two probes and having them touching the mat which is inside the vivs. For me this works perfectly and keeps the temp with half a degree either way.
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| mikerichards |
Posted - 11/02/2010 : 10:36:33
All sounds good! Mat stats work that way all the time, they turn on when the temp drops a bit, then off slightly higher than set, that's normal. If you want a stat that will give you very close tolerances then you need a pulse stat or dimmer.
Leave you thermometer probe in the viv, and put the stat probe taped to the mat, then you can set the temps by the thermometer rather than the innacurate guage on the stat.
If you are worried about holes that the snake can get through then you can silicone them, just leave the snake out for at least 25 hours for the vapour to go away.
Hides wise, you can never have enough, but, they don't have to be conventional, you can use fake plants, these make quite a nice hide, plus they look nice and can be climbed.
Make sure the viv/faunarium is not positioned so as to be in a draft, that can cause rapid temp drops.
I gather the snake is quite small, its better now to provide more shelters as young snakes can become insecure in large open spaces, and will appreciate the extra cover.
All my young snakes live in quite small tubs, roughly 12x6x6, which is adequate for their size, they only have 1 hide and a small water bowl, they don't need vast spaces, but then for show its nicer to have a beautifully set up viv! Mine aren't for show, so have what they need, rather than what makes them look nice.
Good luck with it. |
| elament |
Posted - 11/02/2010 : 09:50:31
I had this problem too with two habistat mat stats and to be honest I backed them at the rep dealer. No matter which way I tried to put the probes the stats would switch on and stay on till ridiculous tempratures then turn of and stay off until the temp in the viv plummeted to 25 or lower. I gave up trying after a couple of days and got my rep dealer to replace it and the one he replaced it with was just as bad. Thinking it was something I was doing I rang him and (bless him) he brought round another one which I set up exactly the same way and its perfect! I now got both stats running within a tolerance of .5c. I even rung eurorep up to complain and they said what I was describing was impossible!! LOL.
If you got a dodgy stat and its got warrenty return it i say.
Also Is your viv or faun in direct sunlight? Sounds implausible I know but i recently discovered just the power of the sun shining through the front glass of my viv was enough to warm the stat probe up enough for it to malfunction. |
| IdenticalTentacle |
Posted - 10/02/2010 : 23:27:09
I have a Ministat 100. I have tried all sorts all day long... Both probes next to each other, the stat probe touching the heat mat, the stat probe slightly further away, it's driving me mental! I guess trial and error is what's gonna resolve the problem eventually, I'm just nervous I'm putting my corn through hell while I try to get it right. |
| kdlang |
Posted - 10/02/2010 : 21:18:20
I made the hole in the top of my faun bigger with a pair of scissors lol. Not ideal but it did the job. After feeding the thermostat and thermometer probs through i fastened them together with a elastic band so they were reading from exactly the same place, then held them in place with Alice's warm hide so he didn't move them. It seemed to keep the temperatures pretty steady between 27 and 29 degrees which I was happy with. Sometimes we had higher readings but I think it was more when Alice was in his hide and probably closer to the probs. What kind of thermostat have you got? |
| Fal |
Posted - 10/02/2010 : 20:52:34
You see that's how I do it with both my Leo and Beardie and it works a treat - but for the corns faun I put the stat probe on the mat and.. well.. it heats up before the faun does, or rather the faun loses heat quicker than the stat probe under the faun, so perhaps Tentacle is having the same problem because it's a plastic, heavily vented faunarium! So yeah, try what Elament says or try covering up some of the lid vents to stop the heat rising and escaping too easily?? |
| elament |
Posted - 10/02/2010 : 20:37:15
does your thermometer have a probe? If so try attaching the probe of the thermometer to the probe of the stat then place both in direct contact with your warm spot (ie where the snake will warm itself) Attach them together using rubber bands DO NOT use tape as tape + snakes = possible disaster |
| Fal |
Posted - 10/02/2010 : 20:30:56
You've certainly found the right place with this forum to get help, and good to see you on here trying to make improvements for your new snake! :) I have had problems with my stat turning off the mat at too low a temp, I've just played around with moving the probe of the stat and then seeing what happens and so on... a bit of patience, persistence and trial and error and I am sure you'll get there :) |
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