| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Lozzy |
Posted - 15/07/2012 : 22:50:20
Basically i got my little man who is ultramel anery and have been reading more and more about how some people dont agree with breeding them so as to keep to con snake gene pool as pure as possible i was just wandering what your views are?
Not ready to breed for a few years yet just interested as i know im biased but i think he is a stunning little snake 
Thanks for your time |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Lozzy |
Posted - 19/07/2012 : 21:17:56
quote:
Originally posted by eeji
quote:
Originally posted by Lozzy
Just to add another question to the mix what would be the most interesting morph to breed with an ultramel anery, wouldn't mind doing it with my snow galaxy, if she ever returns *roll eyes* more to find out if she got any interesting hets hiding but i would need to buy another female as my lavender has kinks so i didn't buy her to breed. What you all think?
Thanks
Snow is the perfect choice, you'd see amel, ultramel, snow and ultramel anery hatchlings :)
Awesome ill keep praying Galaxy comes back then, week 7 and counting :( |
| eeji |
Posted - 19/07/2012 : 21:10:17
quote:
Originally posted by Lozzy
Just to add another question to the mix what would be the most interesting morph to breed with an ultramel anery, wouldn't mind doing it with my snow galaxy, if she ever returns *roll eyes* more to find out if she got any interesting hets hiding but i would need to buy another female as my lavender has kinks so i didn't buy her to breed. What you all think?
Thanks
Snow is the perfect choice, you'd see amel, ultramel, snow and ultramel anery hatchlings :)
quote:
Originally posted by Thorne Walker
Just to be devils advocate...
Doesn't 'do your research' and 'buyer beware' essentially cover that.. if a person is going to be buying a particular morph then looking it up should readily tell a person if it's a hybrid morph..
I'm not trying to make excuses for sellers who are knowingly hide or misrepresent there product but trying to put all teh responsibility on the seller seems a little unfair in my book.
Unfortunately its not that easy, in a lot of cases an amel will look identical to a creamsicle etc |
| oakleyman18 |
Posted - 19/07/2012 : 07:09:06
^ This. |
| Georgina |
Posted - 18/07/2012 : 22:08:41
i had a full blown argument in a reptile shop the other day, they had a cremiscle come in , with a tag saying cremiscle, we spent 20 mins me saying it was a aybrid and her saying it was a different morph. she didnt understand what i meant by hybrid which didnt help. but some one looking for a corn wouldnt think twice if it was labelled cremisicle corn and that girl said yeah its a corn cremiscle just means its colour. i think there you be some sort or standard agency that could monitor some of the goings on in reptile shops. although i know it would be impossible, much like the SG prodject, i think they should then have paper work to say the are SG free and then that can be passed on. |
| oakleyman18 |
Posted - 18/07/2012 : 21:39:08
Oh yeah, for sure, good point. I think its obvious when something labelled as such, ie, Ultramel Anery (the ultra gene), but there could be perhaps an ultramel parent, but for whatever reason the babies aren't visual ultra, they get forgotten, and just labelled as normals, amels, etc.
Of course some people just go in to a shop and buy any old thing ;) |
| Thorne Walker |
Posted - 18/07/2012 : 21:23:35
Just to be devils advocate...
Doesn't 'do your research' and 'buyer beware' essentially cover that.. if a person is going to be buying a particular morph then looking it up should readily tell a person if it's a hybrid morph..
I'm not trying to make excuses for sellers who are knowingly hide or misrepresent there product but trying to put all teh responsibility on the seller seems a little unfair in my book.
|
| Lozzy |
Posted - 18/07/2012 : 20:45:11
Just to add another question to the mix what would be the most interesting morph to breed with an ultramel anery, wouldn't mind doing it with my snow galaxy, if she ever returns *roll eyes* more to find out if she got any interesting hets hiding but i would need to buy another female as my lavender has kinks so i didn't buy her to breed. What you all think?
Thanks |
| oakleyman18 |
Posted - 18/07/2012 : 19:59:44
Couldn't agree more. As Eeji says, 95% of the time it's just because one person wasn't told, and they're honestly selling it on as they had it sold to them. |
| eeji |
Posted - 18/07/2012 : 19:22:14
a lot of the time theres nothing sneaky about it, just people who are unaware of what they have and are producing |
| NexivRed |
Posted - 17/07/2012 : 21:59:48
I agree. People can breed whatever like they, but they shouldn't be sneaky about it. |
| eeji |
Posted - 17/07/2012 : 21:28:19
quote:
Originally posted by Lozzy
quote:
can the same be said for creamsicles or jungles that have a higher percentage of corn? A hybrid is a hybrid is a hybrid, no matter how many times they are crossed into a single parent species.
So eeji do you not agree with breeding them? sorry just really interested in everyone's oppinion
quite the opposite, ultramel anery in particular is a really good looking morph (and I don't even much like grey morphs!). I think people should be free to breed whatever they like, BUT there are two things that get my goat up about it:
1 - hybrids that get sold as 'pure'. How many ads do you see with the title 'creamsicle cornsnake' that someone who doesn't know a creamsicle is a hybrid will come along and buy, then breed, then sell their 'amel corn' hatchlings thus inadvertently 'polluting' corn snake gene pools.
2 - the attitude that 'its been bred into corns for years so it must be a corn' or 'its only 1% xxxxspecies so it may as well be corn' - no it isn't. |
| Thorne Walker |
Posted - 17/07/2012 : 19:27:11
quote:
Originally posted by oakleyman18
You might not be bothered, but at the end of the day, you are diluting the gene pool of two separate species which aren't supposed to breed with each other.
Everyone's entitled to their own opinions, and yeah to be fair there probably isn't much distinction to be honest between the two. But remember we share 98% of the genome of the chimpanzee, and I'd say we were pretty different...! Just because they might be similar, doesn't mean they should be assumed the same, because at the end of the day, they're not.
Who says they aren't supposed to? After all you can't hybridise a corn and a python because they are too different genetically, even other rat snakes (like my Russian) are too dissimilar to produce live offspring with a corn.
Despite the 98% that you mention humans and chimps can't inter breed either and we are very similar internally (same diet means coding for the same digestive process's, same organ structure, etc) aside from some cosmetic differences and structural differences in the brain we are very much identical to chimps.
Also Virus' do a great job of transferring genetic material between the species they infect (which is one of the theory's about why the genome of the human and chimp are so similar).
|
| oakleyman18 |
Posted - 17/07/2012 : 16:58:55
You might not be bothered, but at the end of the day, you are diluting the gene pool of two separate species which aren't supposed to breed with each other.
Everyone's entitled to their own opinions, and yeah to be fair there probably isn't much distinction to be honest between the two. But remember we share 98% of the genome of the chimpanzee, and I'd say we were pretty different...! Just because they might be similar, doesn't mean they should be assumed the same, because at the end of the day, they're not. |
| Thorne Walker |
Posted - 17/07/2012 : 16:17:34
Meh.. how much DNA are we really talking about...
That you can produce viable offspring proves there is not that much difference between them to begin with...
I can't say I'd be worried about the genetic 'purity' of an animal that was even tempered and healthy. |
| NexivRed |
Posted - 17/07/2012 : 13:23:46
I don't think someone should prevent themselves from breeding hybrids, because at the end of the day you could get some beautiful looking snakes out of it. But I think it should always be mentioned that a hybrid has been in the breeding program.
I personally wouldn't bother breeding a hybrid into a corn program that was specifically going for a certain type of morph for people to buy. Because as soon as you mention there was a hybrid in there, it might put people off.
I think just pointing out what generation had a known hybrid (such as the grandparents) is being honest, and a beautiful looking snake will sell itself. |
| kdlang |
Posted - 17/07/2012 : 11:44:34
I think the ultra morphs are gorgeous. However, they are hybrids and as such should always be labelled as hybrids. I will personally stay away from hybrid breeding, not because I don't like what is produced but because, however honest I am in informing buyers of their hybrid roots, whoever purchases from me may not be so honest. How many times to we see queries on here about whether an amel is an amel or a creamsicle. If we hadn't messed around with hybrid breeding in the first place then we wouldn't have this issue arising now and I prefer to try and avoid more of these issues occuring in the future. |
| Lozzy |
Posted - 16/07/2012 : 22:36:08
Thanks oakleyman. Totally agree. I would always be honest if i were to breed. :) |
| oakleyman18 |
Posted - 16/07/2012 : 22:26:10
Personally I think people can breed whatever they want to breed, so long as they are responsible and label it as such. I agree with Eeji on this one... while I also think that the amount of hybrid is probably nearly nothing, it still is what it is :) just make sure every baby you make (if you do) is honestly labelled as a hybrid. |
| Lozzy |
Posted - 16/07/2012 : 19:11:31
quote:
can the same be said for creamsicles or jungles that have a higher percentage of corn? A hybrid is a hybrid is a hybrid, no matter how many times they are crossed into a single parent species.
So eeji do you not agree with breeding them? sorry just really interested in everyone's oppinion |
| eeji |
Posted - 16/07/2012 : 18:47:50
quote:
Originally posted by Figs
I've just had a clutch of ultramel aneries hatch
Personally, I just see them as corns now!
I thought that since they've been bred pure corns over the generations that they are mostly corn now anyways
can the same be said for creamsicles or jungles that have a higher percentage of corn? A hybrid is a hybrid is a hybrid, no matter how many times they are crossed into a single parent species. |
