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hiper2009
Banned
United Kingdom
2197 Posts |
 Posted - 28/06/2010 : 21:18:58
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Poor thing must be very cramped in that kind of space. If i was looking for another cornsnake then i would rescue her but im not and i have my boa coming soon.  |
0.0.0 Royal Python Het Pied 100% CB10 - Chaos
1.1.0 Brazilian Rainbow Boa CB10 - Bow/Mayhem
0.1.0 Cornsnake Amel Het Motley CB10 - Fire
1.0.0 Cornsnake Caramel Het Motley CB09 - Whisky
1.0.0 Cornsnake Snow Het Stripe CB07 - Romeo - R.I.P
1.0.0 Super Golden Labrador Dog CB02 - Bailey
Wish List:
1.2.0 Royal Python - Pastel , Pinstripe , Lesser. |
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Kellog
the nice one
United Kingdom
7308 Posts |
Posted - 29/06/2010 : 04:38:00
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quote:
Originally posted by reptiledanny
well i got a reply to what i sent, and i am very pleased with it........
Well done Danny, I am so glad you sent that email....and I must admit that I am surprised by the reply, I really expected him to either ignore you or reply harshly. He obviously realised that you did what you did cos you love snakes and he appreciated that.
It does make me so sad that his snake can be kept in that sort of environment....but I also know that there are actually snakes who are probably worse off and we have to be realistic, we cant save them all.
Maybe when you next write to him mention the TCS site and suggest that he passes on information about it to the new owners....it is worth trying, I think anything is worth trying to help that snake and you were the one brave enough to do it.
xxx
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reptiledanny
Sub Adult
United Kingdom
1809 Posts |
Posted - 29/06/2010 : 07:27:16
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| i will mention tcsf next time to pass on this forum to the new owner if he ever sells |
1.1 royal pythons 0.1 hog island boa 1.0 corn snake
sig made by stapey |
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Sta~ple
qeeun speler
United Kingdom
6129 Posts |
Posted - 29/06/2010 : 09:33:13
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quote:
Originally posted by reptiledanny
she looks lovely and healthy, just a shame people don't knnow how to care for them properly
It looks far too chunky to me but that would sort itself out when moved into a bigger viv. |
  
A very special super, duper thanks for K :3 |
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Kellog
the nice one
United Kingdom
7308 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2010 : 05:55:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Sta~ple
quote:
Originally posted by reptiledanny
she looks lovely and healthy, just a shame people don't knnow how to care for them properly
It looks far too chunky to me but that would sort itself out when moved into a bigger viv.
Agree with you there Sta~ple....actually made me wonder what it was being fed on and how often....
xxx
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reptiledanny
Sub Adult
United Kingdom
1809 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2010 : 07:59:27
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| yes it looks chunky but it looks healthy apart form that, doesn't look underweight, obviosly, and all healty part from the chinkyness |
1.1 royal pythons 0.1 hog island boa 1.0 corn snake
sig made by stapey |
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mikerichards
don't say the 'M' word!
United Kingdom
2901 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2010 : 13:22:43
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Without actually looking at the snake and knowing exactly how big it is, its virtually impossible to pass any real judgement. Yes it looks very big for 6mnths old, but, that could be to do with the camera doing something with the picture, maybe the picture was resized and left the picture cramped, its too hard to say. I would say the snake looks to be about 3 years old, but there is no way it can grow that fas in such a short space of time, what I would suggest is that the snake is actually a lot smaller than it looks.
As for space, corns don't need a lot of space, its us that need the space, without space we can't put loads of hides in, or lots of plants etc etc.
The actual amount of space they NEED to live contently is a lot smaller than a lot of people think. I think its a little nasty spending 2 pages having a go about something that in reality, you don't actually know what's there, all the facts are not present.
People need to be careful about what they label as cruel and terrible conditions.
You are making those accusations based on what you think, not what is reality.
I know corns and other colubrids can and do not only survive, but flourish in much smaller enclosures, keeping them in a 3 or a 4 foot viv is a luxury, not a necessity. |
Location : Worthing, West Sussex
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mikerichards
don't say the 'M' word!
United Kingdom
2901 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2010 : 13:59:08
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I have looked again, the snake is not as big as it looks, its very fat though, its been over fed.
Other than the obvious issue of no stat and the likes, there is not even the hint of cruelty there, especially considering the amount it is obviously fed!
I think the only thing the person is guilty of is either ignorance, or beleiving the drivel from the petshop. I would go with the latter, as afterall, petshops know everything about what the sell!!!!
Incidentally, I think a 3 foot viv is too big still. All that viv needs is a small hide and a branch to climb on.
All the snake needs is slimfast! |
Location : Worthing, West Sussex
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Sta~ple
qeeun speler
United Kingdom
6129 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2010 : 14:08:14
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I was looking at the leaves in the picture and comparing it's fatness to them since I have the same plant, that's why I thought it was chunky. Surely iof it was the camera makming the snake look big, it would have also blown up the leaves more? Also the tail makes it look like it's fat or going to have a massive poo!
I get what you say about the size, one of my adults would be happy in a 2ft x 1 RUB for all it's life, but in that photo, it does look very much like water bowel and the rest of the viv is taken up by a snake. Surely no matter what size the viv/RUB is there should be enough room for water and 2 small hides or one big long one that stretches from the hot to cool end. The masive looking water bowel is taking a lot of room up though so I guess he would be fine if a smaller one was put in and a hide.
I don't think he was being cruel, as you said, he/she was probabaly following petshop advise. If he got told the same thing's as I got told then no wonder he has a chunky snake. I think his fatness also makes the viv look smaller and may also make him look bigger/longer somehow. |
A very special super, duper thanks for K :3 |
Edited by - Sta~ple on 30/06/2010 14:09:14 |
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mikerichards
don't say the 'M' word!
United Kingdom
2901 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2010 : 15:36:16
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I think you are right, as mentioned the sanke is over weight, if it was normal weight then things would look very different. None of my snakes at 6 months old would have a house that big, not even the boas! My little salmon hypo has a 2x1 and he is getting on for 4ft.
I know each snake is different, but the only thing wrong with this persons setup is the fact that the equipment is not up to scratch, and the only thing wrong with the snake is that its fat, that's what you can see on the tail, its 'hips'. I think the advice that needs to be given to the owner is to cut down on the feeding, at a guess, I would say its having food every 4 or 5 days, and more than one or two at a time. |
Location : Worthing, West Sussex
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Sta~ple
qeeun speler
United Kingdom
6129 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2010 : 16:34:05
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I know even know how big that viv is, it's a shame it doesn't say really, It looks like 12x12 or 18x18 but then if you go by the cds it looks like it's 2ft long. I have never seen a snake if it is 6 months so fat though! (if it is 6 months) I imagined that they would reguagate their food if it was too much at a young age or grow very long, very fast.
My corn was a simular size to your boa mike and the same size, she was very happy in there for months. She's not in there now though as I wnated my feeding and cleaning out RUB back since she now has a viv although she doesn't seem to like iot as much as the RUB. I wouldn't feel happy putting my other adult in something that small not because he's 5ft but because he's always so active so he benfits from any extra space.
Could be fed rats as well, it is actually older than it says. My petshop always loved to tell me that my corns as adults should be feeidng on small/medium rats since I can't see the bump of an x-large mouse and to feed every week. I guess no-one looks at a rat and thinks that they are fattining and have loads of good stuff in them. I wouldn't take that snake long to get to a healthy weight.
I wonder if he is actually selling the viv? It's not listed but I would assume so? |
A very special super, duper thanks for K :3 |
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mikerichards
don't say the 'M' word!
United Kingdom
2901 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2010 : 16:50:37
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I don't know, I mentioned about the pics as I can only see them on my phone at the mo, so they will never be great! Rats are only more fatty because they carry much more body fat, that's it really. Feeding rats to a corn is not going to hurt it!!
I would guess that the snake in question is a greedy sod, and likes his food, so won't regurge anything worth keeping! If a snake is a little over fed then it will grow length very quickly, but if its fed more than it can use to grow then it will get fat also.
I would say that viv is 18x18x18, its plenty big enough, but as an extra some climbing gear would be beneficial! The key now is to feed it properly, it will lose weight quite quickly until it balances out to its own ideal weight, sadly, those hips will probably never go away now.
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Location : Worthing, West Sussex
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Kellog
the nice one
United Kingdom
7308 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2010 : 04:25:52
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You are right in what you say Mike....and we are all very quick to rush to judgement in defence of the snake, purely because of our love of them....and I am as guilty of that as everyone else. I just know how I reacted when I first saw those pictures, and responded to that reaction....without enough thought.
I do think overfeeding is probably an issue (as I said in my previous post) and it is sad to think that it will probably now have effected the snake for life - 'sadly, those hips will probably never go away now.' But so much of this is down to bad advice and ignorance....and again, I have been caught out by bad advice and am guilty of ignorance. I am just blessed I found a site like this that put me on the right track.
It is definitely difficult to tell from pics the size, without something to use as a scale....and pics also distort things massively. So again, a rush to judgement based on what you see in a pic is not a good thing....except when you see things that are obvious....
....like the fact that the snake is overweight and its age is questionable and the fact that it doesnt have any hides or branches to climb. And there is also the info given which shows the missing equipment....stat and thermometer. But again that missing equipment could purely be down to lack of knowledge or bad knowledge.
I think Danny did a good thing emailing the owner. He tried not to sound judgemental, just showing his concern for the snake and pointing out what he thought was wrong....and the response hopefully shows that it has got the owner thinking. If only all owners got guided in the right direction for good advice and support....but then this isnt a perfect world.
xxx
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reptiledanny
Sub Adult
United Kingdom
1809 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2010 : 08:06:06
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i did also ask for pics of the snake being handled so we could compare for size, he looks over sized in the pic, but then if u look at pics of bullet that i posted, he looks bigger than he is, so could be due to how close the pic was taken. the owner has spoiled the snake to obesity, so therfor he looks huge, part of that obesity though will be due to the size of the cage being to small for him, therfor not getting enough exersize
i emailed the owner out of concern for the snake, not to lecture someone about how they have missraised there snake |
1.1 royal pythons 0.1 hog island boa 1.0 corn snake
sig made by stapey |
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Sta~ple
qeeun speler
United Kingdom
6129 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2010 : 08:39:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Kellog
I do think overfeeding is probably an issue (as I said in my previous post) and it is sad to think that it will probably now have effected the snake for life - 'sadly, those hips will probably never go away now.' But so much of this is down to bad advice and ignorance....and again, I have been caught out by bad advice and am guilty of ignorance. I am just blessed I found a site like this that put me on the right track.
The hip's aren't really a problem unless you want a perfectly asethically pleasing snake :p The snake isn't bothered by them at all well at least I know Venom isn't. |
A very special super, duper thanks for K :3 |
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mikerichards
don't say the 'M' word!
United Kingdom
2901 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2010 : 13:35:35
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I am not suggesting you lectured anyone, I have myself emailed people about their snakes, it shows care, not arrogance, its down the the keeper how they perceive that advice.
Snakes do not need excercise, that is a perception by us because that is what we need to maintain a healthy life, snakes don't need that. Snakes get more excercise by strike feeding and constricting than they do from moving about. Most snakes are so lazy that given the choice they would have a water bowl in their bed, and food delivered to the hide, well, they are halfway there already!! The viv is not too small, its purely down to the snakes being overweight that it looks that way. |
Location : Worthing, West Sussex
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does this look right
