| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| baitman |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 13:16:53
I am going to be breeding my own feeder mice and am wondering, i am going to be keeping my snakes in the spare room, it measures 10 x 8 x 8,i know you will say its not advisable but i was thinking can i keep my mice in a tank in the same room....
what are the ups and downs of doing this....
will the snakes be able to smell the mice and if so, is that really a bad thing.... |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| simonw |
Posted - 23/01/2011 : 17:39:56
You can keep mice in the same room, but they may not breed well if they sense danger from the snakes. You may find they nom their babies when they are born - a normal stress response.
I'd argue that it's not fair for the mice, but it can be done.
You also need to be aware of the size of the operation. You'll need 3 tubs for mice (male, female and mixed breeding). It's not much fun cleaning them all out if you don't enjoy mice for the sake of mice (all my family spend far more time with them than the snakes!)
If you do like mice, then just get plain white ones, or you can get attached to them :) After all they have the ability to be far more affectionate than snakes.
As for killing - pinkies straight in freezer as people have said, anything else cervical dislocation is the most humane way - it's instant. Drop it, smack it or whack it on a counter and you stand to just hurt it a lot, which is pretty cruel.
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| lotabob |
Posted - 23/01/2011 : 16:35:59
True, my Royal perks up when I'm feeding my Corn snake, I really would not want to put my hand in there with food around, I defrost in another room now so I can pick him up without getting savaged. I'm sure with mouse stink in the room I would have some pretty beat up hands quite quickly. I'm sure there are corn snakes out there that will react to the smell of their prey. |
| mikerichards |
Posted - 23/01/2011 : 16:04:59
It does depend on the snake to be fair, corns generally arent a problem ever. If you had my female hogg island boa would would feel differently though! |
| bigal |
Posted - 23/01/2011 : 13:29:48
I here what you say Mike but I have done it for several months with no problem. Corse if I get tagged I could be singing a different tune. |
| mikerichards |
Posted - 22/01/2011 : 16:37:40
I would be tempted not to keep rats/mice in the same room as the snakes, it only takes a couple of days for the mice to smell enough for us to smell them, let alone the snakes. In my opinion its asking for a snake to mistake you for food. |
| MickyB |
Posted - 22/01/2011 : 10:41:22
quote:
Originally posted by bigal
Back to the original question I keep my snakes in the same room as my pet rats and neither animals seem to be stressed by it. I just make sure "out" time doesent happen at the same time and most importantly wash hands between handeling rats and snakes. Might be pushing it putting rat smelling hands in snake Viv.
i think the only problem that could occur is the snake getting used to the scent and may ignore it but saying that a hungry snake is still a hungry snake |
| MickyB |
Posted - 22/01/2011 : 10:37:35
quote:
Originally posted by Gaz_1989
Agree with mike. Really no need to gas or freeze.
Mikes method is instant and not at all cruel.
how is bashing a mouses heading on my kitchen counter not cruel lol  probs is the fastest way tho personally for a couple of snakes id just buy the mice dead it would be hassle for me to breed im a bit lazy if dont have to i wont probably be more cost effective if you had a lot of snakes tho and worth the hassle |
| bigal |
Posted - 22/01/2011 : 10:30:18
Back to the original question I keep my snakes in the same room as my pet rats and neither animals seem to be stressed by it. I just make sure "out" time doesent happen at the same time and most importantly wash hands between handeling rats and snakes. Might be pushing it putting rat smelling hands in snake Viv. |
| Gaz_1989 |
Posted - 22/01/2011 : 10:17:16
Agree with mike. Really no need to gas or freeze.
Mikes method is instant and not at all cruel.
|
| mikerichards |
Posted - 22/01/2011 : 09:05:05
There is no need to gas any mice of any size. the only reason this is done comercially is because there are a huge number being done at once.
the reason you dont gas pinkies is because they do not metabolise the gas very well, and tend to suffer for quite a while before it ends up dying.
The theory of puttting pinkies in the freezer does from what i have seen, work. the reason is, pinkies are hairless, nothing to keep warm in, they themselves are not capable of generating their own heat, or enough to keep themselves warm enough to live. when pinkies are put in the freezer, they dont freeze to death, they shock, thats what kills them, their body temp drops so fast they go into shock and thats what kills them, its actually very quick, much quicker than gassing.
As for the drop method, unless you are going to help it on the way down, its a waste of time, your food will just run off, fast.
I dropped one of my feeder mice, totally accidentally, it hit the floor and teleported under the counter, i didnt even see it move, it was that fast.
when i kill my mice, the simplest and quickest method is hold my the tail swing hard onto a hard surface, any stress to the mouse lasts about 1/2 a second, i always do it so they hit back first, maximum impact on the back of the head, if you have to do it twice, you did it wrong and just caused immense suffering.
the easiest way to see if you did it right is to touch their eye ball, if they blink, whack again, if they dont, they are dead, even if they are trying to run on the spot, and they will be trying to, its normal.
Gassing is fine, but i think its a waste of time and money for only a few mice, it will make your own breeders as expensive as buying in bulk, and a lot more hassle.
As for live feeding, thats a total last resort unless you have baby boas and pythons, dont go down that road with your corn, you dont need to. |
| SexyBear77 |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 18:49:46
Not impressed by the talk of freezing or dropping tbh, it seems there is a bit of a lack of concern for the feeder animals welfare and research. I am glad to see you have changed your mind.
What I will say however, for anyone else reading, is that dropping onto a paving slab will NOT outright kill a mouse or rat, they can survive great falls. You are running the risk of the prey running off or just being badly injured.
CO2 chambers are definitely one of the most humane ways to dispatch feeder rodents, and, as far as I can tell, are very simple to set up.
Gassed rodents are perfectly safe to feed to your snake. |
| Sta~ple |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 18:28:53
c02 is supposed to not be an very effective way to kill pinkies and baby mice looking at other old topics, that's all I'll say *whistle* neither is force. |
| a33272 |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 18:28:33
http://www.happyhillbilly.com/co2/
http://www.thereddragonsden.com/co2.htm
this one is ideal as they are using a gas bottle u can get from halfords i think !!!!
http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/feeder/544392-co2-chamber.html |
| a33272 |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 18:25:38
co2 can be brought from welding suuply shops etc, also try local gun smiths as they often have them as its used for some air rifles
|
| baitman |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 18:10:25
been looking for a diy pic of a chamber but cant find one.....
where are the co2 cannisters obtainable from? |
| Benji54 |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 17:44:44
that or a fire extinguisher and some tupperwear boxes lol!
***this is a joke, please dont actually do it lol*** |
| a33272 |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 16:07:18
yeah there simple to diy in simples terms u need a small plastic box, some rubber pipe a co2 bottle and regulator, all you do is very slowly allow co2 into the box so as to not cause discomphort and put them to sleep then increase the co2 to kill them
google co2 chamber, u can use dry ice but then u need to make platforms inside the chamber so gas is better
http://www.thereptilerack.com/kb/entry/14/ |
| baitman |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 15:56:56
all points taken on board, i hadnt realised it was that painfull, what exactly are the co2 chambers and can they be diy'ed.
what about vacuuming, i have one of those things that suck the air out of clothing for packing, could i put them in that and just take all the air out?? |
| Benji54 |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 14:27:23
quote:
Originally posted by a33272
but freezing causes ice crystals to form in the blood causing un-needed pain, how would u like to die in a freezer!! dont want to feed a snake gased food, co2 is a gas we breath out that is all around us anyway so why would it be a problem.
most people on here that have mentioned wanted to breed there own mice have done it so they can ensure they have a good life before they are finally dispatched humainly
yeah i do agree, just puttin em in a domestic freezer is a bit of a torture really. itll take a while. the way i was talkin bout, the way its done comercially, the gas is sooo cold the death is instant and humane. |
| a33272 |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 14:22:10
but freezing causes ice crystals to form in the blood causing un-needed pain, how would u like to die in a freezer!! dont want to feed a snake gased food, co2 is a gas we breath out that is all around us anyway so why would it be a problem.
most people on here that have mentioned wanted to breed there own mice have done it so they can ensure they have a good life before they are finally dispatched humainly |
